What do you think is in the blue bag?
Why does Dure stuff his relive's body into the valise? How would one even manage this?
Why does the narrator volunteer to go to the crossroads for Dure and his family? Is it only to get the kids to the clinic, or is there another reason?\
Although filled with superstitions, this burial is not much more odd than the burial traditions of many religions and cultures. What burial traditions do you find odd in today's society...or even in your own religion?
39 comments:
There are many burial traditions around the world that are very strange that happen to this day. One example is turning the remains of a loved one into beads. People in South Korea do this and use them as decorations in their homes. A second example is cremation, which takes place in many places around the world including the Unite States. I find cremation a strange burial tradition, yet it is a very common thing to do with remains in the United States. The last example is called turning of the bones, which is a burial tradition for the Malagasy people of Madagascar. Turning of the bones is a tradition that takes place once every seven years where they exhume the bodies of loved ones, wrap them in cloth, and dance with them. There are many more strange traditions that still take occur today, but there were many more that used to happen hundreds of years ago.
I am calling it now that the blue bag holds the copy of The Jungle Book that belonged to Natalia’s grandfather. There has been so much emphasis placed upon the book; The Jungle Book is constantly being mentioned throughout the novel. It would make no sense not to have it in the blue bag. Literally from page one, her grandfather’s copy of Rudyard Kipling’s classic is established as a very significant item to the plot of the story. For instance, Natalia’s grandfather decided to use his copy of The Jungle Book as a pledge to the deathless man in his first encounter.
At the end of this chapter, Natalia offers to take the ashes of the discovered body to the crossroads so long as the children receive medical attention. At first glance, it does seem like Natalia is simply doing this in order to finally get the children some sort of help for their illnesses. However, after my theory of the book being in the blue bag, this is what I think is going to happen. Since the mora comes to collect the dead, I believe Natalia is going to the crossroads to deliver not only the cousin of the diggers but her grandfather as well. I can already see a turn of events where the mora turns out to be deathless man; this will allow the deathless man to finally receive his pledge from Natalia’s grandfather, wrapping up the deathless man story arc.
I think the narrator volunteers to go to the crossroads for the Dure family to allow the children to get the help that they need and to also them out in a time of need with their dead family member. When the narrator's grandfather died there really wasn't anyone there to help him, sure he was at some sort of health clinic but he didn't get the top best quality care he could have received at a better medical clinic. I think this will also help the narrator cope with the death of her grandfather by helping someone else's family when they need it the most. Also, by going up to the crossroads she is allowing the children to get the right medical help that they need to continue to live healthy lives.
There are a lot of burial traditions in our own country and other countries as well. Way back when, I know in the U.S at least, families would cut off some hair of their passed loved ones and make pictures or designs out of it and hang it up to remember them by. I think that's strange just because, as far as I know, most people don't do that anymore. I mean, I'm sure some cultures think it's strange that we burn our loved ones and then keep their ashes in our houses. No matter what burial tradition or tradition for the dead there is it helps those people grieve and helps them feel closer to their lost loved ones and that's what's important.
There is a lot of possibilities that could be in the blue bag. What I think is in the blue bag is the real belongings of the grandfather. The family has gone through so much with the death of him and not being able to spend the full 40 days with him. I think the story needs to be able to have some closure with him. Having his proper items in the bag would be a great way to obtain closure for the grandfathers passing. The items that I hope that would be in the bag would be the watch, glasses, and the Jungle Book. Those are three of his belongings that are talked about the most in the story so it would make sense to have those items in the bag with all of his belongings.
I just find it interesting that most cultures or religions prep the body or bury the body in a way that helps them in the afterlife. The ancient Egyptians would put the belongings of the deceased in the tomb with them so they're happy after death. In Judaism, they try to keep the body as intact as possible and perform cleansing rituals on it so that the person could be happy even after death. I know some people here that do the same thing. When my Aunt died, we buried her dog with her because it was the thing she loved the most, and my cousins wanted her to be happy in the afterlife with him. I don't think any of these things are very odd, I just think it's different in a cool way.
I believe that Natalia’s grandfather’s copy of The Jungle Book is in the blue bag. The narrator described the bag as “mortuary cold”. The fact that Natalia has The Jungle Book means that her grandfather doesn't have it. This copy of the book was very important to him as it was from his past and so for him to not have the book means that something drastic must've occurred to him. There was a lot of emphasis placed on the book and for it to have not turned up in the package of Natalia’s grandfather’s stuff when he died is a bit suspicious.
Dure shoved his cousin’s dead body into the old suitcase since he [Dure] was unable to provide his cousin with a proper coffin. Considering that Dure is a mechanic and the rest of his family are in labour jobs, Dure probably couldn't afford for a nice coffin for his relative. The valise was the next best option that would keep the weather and animals away.
Burial traditions are always something that vary depending on location. Obviously, we are very used to certain things with the funeral and the burial. For example, taking the ashes of a loved one and keeping them in your home instead of burying them. To us, this is pretty normal and I know that when my grandpa passed away, my grandma kept his ashes instead of burying them so that when she eventually passes away, they can buried together. If I really think about it, I realize how bizarre that actually is to keep the ashes of your loved one in your house and to other countries with different traditions, I can understand how weird that must be. Another thing that comes to mind when I think of burial traditions is the celebration of Dia de los Muertos. This isn a direct burial tradition but, every year in Mexico, it is the celebration of those who have died filled with music, art, and lots of color. It is a wonderful way to celebrate life but so vastly different than funerals for us where the dominant color is black and the mood is much more solemn and serious compared to the more joyous celebrations.
I think that, being a doctor and all, she volunteers mainly to just have the family come to the clinic. She has tried multiple times to appeal to the father, each time being rejected. Most times, docotor's truly do have a passion for helping people feel and get better. Another reason she volunteered could be the fact that she just recently lost a loved one (her grandpa). After feeling this heartbreak and sadness, I'm sure any decent person wouldn't wish that on anyone. It is hard going through something like that so I'm sure she just wants to protect them from losing each other.
Something that is so normal to us is having a body creamated after passing away. I understand that a benefit can be it saves a ton of space, but the crazy thing to me is how people store/display it in their house or wear it in a necklace. That constant reminder that they are with you though makes me understand why people do it! To other countries though, it may seem odd!
I think that the way funerals are held in general are very, very strange. Going to a building full of those a person was close to in life to stare at their dead body- which, in death, is bloated and colored into some gross reflection of life- and cry is just a little weird to me. I understand the sharing of grief, and I think it's a great and powerful thing. However, having open caskets has just always been sort of unsettling to me. I think that personally I feel that the way death is celebrated in New Orleans or how it is viewed in Mexico during Dia de los muertos would be better- less a mourning over a loss and more of a celebration of how the person lived. Death is inevitable, and I think that cultures that look upon it in a more favorable light have the best ideas on how to deal with it when it does happen and the healthiest mindset for moving on.
I think that the grandfather's book is probably in the bag, among some of his other most important possessions, like glasses and his watch. Since the book has been so important to him, it only makes sense that he would have it with him wherever he goes.
As for the valise, I agree with Kim. I think that he probably just wanted to give his cousin the nicest burial he could afford. Although when you contemplate how this was managed, the situation becomes a little more mysterious because you wonder how it fit.
I'm not sure why Natalia volunteers to go to the crossroads. I think it may have something to do with all the stories she has heard from her grandfather. They may have heightened her interest in mysterious things, like the deathless man or Luka's disappearance, and she may want an experience like that for her own. She may also just feel really bad for the kids not getting medical treatment, so she's willing to do anything to get them in for treatment.
It's possible that Dure put the body in a suitcase to make it look less suspicious while carrying it out in the open, as well as to keep the body inside of something that will be almost impossible to open from the inside. I would say the only way that the body was able to fit in such a small container is if it was already dead. There would be no possible way for someone to stuff an unwilling body into a suit case. It's hard to say how Dure did this. He probably had to bend the body in ways a body should not bend. Maybe it was the only thing he had that would fit to bury a body underground. And also is it just me that finds it very odd that everyone knows this guy killed someone and he just gets away with it? Is it because everyone is just so desperate to get ride of the illness going around? Who knows, maybe this disease will stay even after the body is found.
There are many different burial traditions that some people view as normal and some people view as odd. This example may not be part of the burial process, but it takes place after the death of a loved one. Back in the day, people would take photos of the deceased. Some times even the whole family would be in the photo. Today, no one would even think about taking photos like that. Most people want to remember their loved ones through photographs that capture their loved ones alive.
A burial tradition I find odd in society and kind of gross is in South Korea when people pass away, instead of cremation or burial they will have the remains of the person made into gem-like beads that come in different colors and display them in their house. Although that's creative, that is also very weird in my opinion. Another weird tradition is in the Philippines, when someone dies, they blindfold the dead and place them outside the house. Then the neighbors come over and dress them and put them in a chair with a lit cigarette in their mouth. I'm not sure how long they leave them there and honestly I don't want to know either, but those are just some traditions I find to be a little weird.
I think the narrator volunteers to go to the crossroads for two reasons. One is to get Dure’s children to the clinic, but that isn’t the main reason for her volunteering. I think she has an ulterior motive that has to do with her search for the deathless man and finding closure in her grandfather’s death.
After all the hassle it took to get the blue bag, I’m hoping that it has her grandfather’s copy of The Jungle Book, his glasses, and his watch. I think what is in the blue bag is also important on her search for the deathless man. Natalia is now in possession of The Jungle Book, which was what her grandfather pledged to the deathless man. Maybe these items can somehow play a part in her search for closure and finding the deathless man.
Dure stuffs the body into the valise because it was probably the closest thing he could give to a proper burial at the time. I’m not sure how he managed to get a body into a suitcase and I don’t think I want to know either.
I believe that Natalia's grandfathers bag is filled with the clothes he was wearing on the day of his death, his wristwatch, the copy of The Jungle Book given to him by the apothecary, maybe some spare change, and a picture of his beloved family. There may be other this in the bag but they were not described in the story to my knowledge. But to whatever is really in it, Natalia is not to find out because her grandmother told her not to open it because it is like robbing a coffin.
The reason why Natalia said she would bring the valise to the crossroad was initially to send his kids to the monastery and get some help with their illness. But as soon as she heard about a "mora" she wanted to find out who it was; she was hoping it was the deathless man to whom she would talk with about her father. I believe that she was doing the right thing to go and bury the valise for Dure and not just no one else was found. In the end she ended up following the figure that was the supposed "mora".
Obviously the blue bag is Natalia's grandfather's belongings. He was far from home so whatever was on him at the time of his death is what will be in the bag. Probably not a lot of things all together. I think his glasses will be in there for sure along with his copy of the Jungle Book. Other personal belongings are sure to be in there, but is it possible that there may be something in there that Natalia's grandmother does not want her to see? It's hard to say considering she didn't even know where he was at the time, but it is suspicious that she is so adamant on keeping this bag sealed. It could just be her opinion on privacy rights for her husbands belongings and resentment for Natalia holding back information from her, but I cant help to wonder why she becomes so sensitive about the bag.
I think Natalia offers to go to the crossroads for multiple reasons. First and foremost she is concerned about the children. However, I also believe the crossroads may be a place of curiosity for her. She obviously doesn't understand the way of these people and wants to submerge herself in their traditions. Finally, the crossroads is a symbol of death and peace with the passing of someone. Natalia has her grandfather constantly on the back of her mind. She came to terms with his illness long ago, but I don't think she's fully come to terms with his death. This traditional site and the burial proceedings may give her a sense of closeness and peace with the death she continues to deal with daily.
I have never thought about different burial traditions that take place in society. The ones that are the most common in todays society are cremation and embalming. An example of another burial tradition is in eastern Indonesia where the funeral can last from days to weeks. At this funeral they have a water buffalo carry the deceased’s soul to the afterlife. Another example takes place in South Korea where they have burial beds. Basically, they cremate the body and put it into gems, jewelry, etc. "burial beds" and display them in their house.
I believe that Natalia volunteered to go to the crossroads for Dure and his family primarily out of self-interest. I don't know why, but this entire novel I've been under the impression that Natalia is a self-preserving and even a little selfish individual, but that could just be me. Either way, I think the reason why she went to the crossroads was because of the connection it had to her grandfather's stories- and she knew that the deathless man collected at the crossroads, and her curiosity peaked. I think she was searching for answers, as well. Throughout this whole process, I feel like Natalia hasn't exactly given herself the time to process what she has lost, and going to the crossroads for Dure was a desperate grab for understanding. However, I don't want to completely disregard the fact that she did agree to go under the circumstances that Dure and his family went to the clinic to be checked out and treated, and had they not agreed to that, I can't be certain in saying that Natalia would have gone. All in all, I think her trip to the crossroads was primarily for herself, but she did make sure it would benefit the sick as well.
I believe Natalia volunteers to go to the crossroads for Dure and his family to help the kids. She wants to help the kids to the clinic to help them get treated and become healthier. But I also think she has a self interest for wanting to go to the crossroads.
I never really thought about burial traditions, I only know of cremating and embalming. I do know that one tradition is when their loved ones have passed away they play jazz at the funeral. In all cases for burial traditions we send our loved ones off to the after life, and we do it to where they can find peace and rest.
There are many burial traditions that are weird around the world including people in the Philippines believing that having the coffin higher to the sky would be closer the deceased was to heaven, so the coffins would be hanging on the sides of mountains just to be the highest in the sky. A second example is in the Republic of Kiribati in the central Pacific a few months after burial the family will dig up the body and take out the skull. The skull is then polished and preserved to display in their homes. Theses traditions I think are very creepy, I think just the normal burial in the ground is perfect, but not to dig them up months after. Cremation is another option and very famous tradition in the United States. I do not like this because I think it is just creepy because after the body is burned you have to keep the ashes somewhere like in a necklace or in a vase. I think in general all burial traditions are weird in there own ways but everyone celebrates death of a loved one in a different way.
I don't know what to think is in the blue bag. I am hoping that it is her grandfathers things, because when she got them the people were so unsure, and she never checked to open the bag to see if it was his stuff. Like Cathryn said, I think if it is his stuff in there it will be the Jungle Book. It is mentioned over and over again throughout the novel and it is very important to the narrator. I think that it will be it because later if she finds it thats what it is, it will add a big sentimental thing to the book. She will have found her childhood book and she will have know her grandfather was thinking of her.
One example of a weird burial was the vikings. They would put the person who died on their boat burry them or burn them. Some vikings were buried with horses or wagons, to help there trip to the next world.
Burial traditions freak me out , every burial tradition is odd in its own way. One tradition in Eastern Indonesia that makes my skin crawl is that they have a special room for the dead where they still feed and take them out to social gatherings. They do this because funerals are so expensive and it takes awhile to save up. A tradition in South Korea is to have the relative cremated and then turned into beads that you could put on display in your house. If I saw them I’d think they are possessed, just because I know that someone's body is in the beads. All traditions involving death makes me feel like the dead person is watching and I don’t like that feeling.
There are many burial traditions in the US some very large some just small things. Some people pass down heirlooms or collect a lock of hair to remember their ancestors by. In my family, we just have a traditional burial we don't practice any special things or pass things down. In previous situations, we have done celebrations of life instead of a showing, but that is rare. Some families keep their parents/grandparents' ashes in a vase, I think that is a popular tradition.
I think that the blue bag has all of his actual belongings that the family hoped to get back. The family hoped to get back his copy of The Jungle Book, his wedding band, his glasses that he has had for years, as well as his watch. They are all significant part of Natalia's grandfather's life. The objects are extremely important to the family, especially because they weren't with him when he passed. The artifacts would bring some peace and comfort to the family. If those are the items in the blue bag, it would really bring the whole thing together for the family, because they would be able to have some of the things that they would remember Natalia's grandfather by.
I think the narrator volunteers to go to the crossroads because of the stories of the deathless man. Maybe she thinks that with her grandfathers death, perhaps by some miracle she will get to see the deathless man. I also think she might feel the need to see him because she thinks it would offer some closure for her grandfather. What I think is really interesting is the connection between the way the deathless man speaks of death rituals and how this burial seem to follow it.
When Natalia offers to take the heart to the crossroads, she does so impulsively. She says she'll take it if Dure sends his wife and kids to the clinic the next day. While I don't doubt that Natalia would use the heart as a bargaining piece, the lack of thought when she first says yes leads me to believe this isn't her main motive. Zora hasn't been talking to Natalia and gave her, "A look she formerly reserved for Ironglove and the records administrator who worked at the University registrar's office" (232) when she got back from Zdrevkov. By now it's safe to assume that Zora knows Natalia has been lying to her. I think like Natalia's grandmother, Zora wants to hear Natalia fess up about her lying. Having Dure send his wife and kids to the clinic is an (admittedly helpful) way of avoiding Zora.
I don’t know if I believe there is anything in the bag. Or, well, I am almost positive the Jungle Book is not in there. Dure stuffs his cousin’s body into a suitcase so it would be easier to find later, either that or it was the thing he had that closest resembled a coffin. Natalia agrees to go to the crossroad not only because of the kids, but probably because of her grandpa’s story of the deathless man and how he was the one who led the dead to the crossroads for his uncle. Maybe she believes her grandpa is there, or at least the deathless man.
There are a lot of really weird burial traditions around the world. I didn't really know how many strange traditions that there are until I looked it up. The Melanesians and the Wari would eat the dead because they thought that it made a connection between the living and the dead. In some cultures, people could have suspended burials where the dead would be put in coffins that hung over cliffs or in caves. There were cultures that would cut off fingers after they lost loved ones, and some of the traditions are even weirder and scarier than these.
Living in Japan, one of the largest differences I noticed was how people memorialize their dead. Cemeteries are composed of large stone monuments, often with places to put flowers or burn incense and the family's name is etched into the granite. Unlike in America, the Japanese are nearly always cremated after death, and the ashes are rarely kept together in one place. Buddhist families often put some of the ashes in a small container and keep it in a family alter at the local shrine (much like the one I lived at, and the one I visited with my host mother). Beside my first host family home, which was a Buddhist shrine, there were some granite grave markers right beside my house. It reminded me of how sometimes people in America are buried near a church they belonged to. I later learned from my host mother that Buddhists believe their dead family members become deities, which they remember and bring offerings to periodically.
All in all, it's a very unique way of preserving the memory of their dead. The Japanese believe their ancestors are always with them, and that the ghosts of their dead actually return to the world of the living during a certain holiday time. Americans would likely see it as absurd, but they see it as a way of respecting their loved ones.
The blue bag contains Natalia's grandfather's copy of The Jungle Book. Also, his watch is most likely in there and anything else he had with him at his death. Natalia volunteered to help the kids because she simply wanted to help. She always had that soft spot for kids. Cremation has always seemed weird to me, although I understand why it is done. I don't know about others, but having someone's ashes in my house is kind of creepy. I don't see the thoughtfulness in something that was burned.
I feel like Natalia offered to bring the jar to the crossroads for one reason, to help Dure's children. Natalia has emphasized many times to Dure, only to be denied the permission to give his kids shots that would save their lives. Both the kids were constantly coughing, and Dure's son was forced to work digging even while ill. I personally feel that Dure should have been arrested for child abuse, refusing to give his kids life saving medicine. Moving on, burial, no matter how you put it, is odd. From shoving a heart into a jar with coins, to burying a preserved body will always be weird to others, but will not be weird within your community. Burial practices can be related to food, for example Sweet tea. In southern parts of the United States, sweet tea is common and at every restaurant premixed. While in northern parts of the United States, sweet tea is uncommon and vice versa. In total, burial practices are weird to people outside of the culture where the burial was created.
Many burial traditions nowadays are so common core that we don't even question it anymore, though they are odd and weird. I was close friends with the Scout family and Johnathan, and I vividly remember his wake and funeral. His wake was the worst. I didn't understand why wakes happen. It was my first one. I think it's kind of morbid to look at the dead body. It did nothing but upset me. It didn't bring me peace or anything. I'm not sure why it needs to happen.
I definitely think The Jungle Book is within the bag, but I don't know what else. I think the reason she volunteers to go to the crossroads is because in the legends people who died would go to a crossroad on their 40th day and she wanted to be with the spirit of her grandfather or maybe even stumble upon the old "Deathless Man" Gavran. The only time I have ever heard of people's bodies being stuffed in suitcases is by bad people in mob stories where they needed to dispose of bodies without the police finding out, so I don't what's going on there.
There are many newer "burial" traditions in today's society that I have found strange and interesting.I once saw an article about a company that you could donate your body too and they would cremate it and use the remains to develop coral like structures to be placed in the ocean where coral reefs had been destroyed. It seemed extremely strange to me at first but some people must have done it or the story would not have been run.
i think cremation is an odd burial tradition and I think the spreading of ashes is really odd. I wouldn't want my body to be spread around in the ocean or the wind or the ground. I would want my body in one place in one piece. I don't think spreading ashes is a good idea because future generations will never get to visit the grave of an ancestor if all of their ashes were spread. i think the narrator offers to go to the crossroads not only for the kids, but because she is in search of the deathless man. She hopes she will find him and give him answers about her grandfather.
The narrator could have a couple reasons for volunteering to go to the crossroads for Dure. The first is the obvious one, to finally get Dure to take his kids to the clinic, but I also think the author is curious about what she'll find there. I don't think she expects to see the town's mora, like Dure and his family believe, but the deathless man. I'm not entirely certain why she wants to see him, maybe to find the truth about his existence for herself, maybe to ask him about her grandfather.
To be honest, I've always thought that burying people in a cemetery is kind of a strange tradition. I understand that it's important for people to have a designated spot to come and visit their loved ones, but why do they need to be buried underground in some random plot of land in a cemetery? That designated spot could be anywhere, maybe in a place that was important to the deceased? I think it's possible to keep the memory of loved ones alive without needing to bury them in the ground.
Post a Comment