(Photo Credit: http://4.bp.blogspot.com)
Joe knows about symbolic gestures -- he puts the indenture papers in the fire. Also symbolic is what the clergyman reads at the service (though it is only briefly mentioned). What is the idea of the sermon about the rich man and the kingdom of Heaven? Why does Pip not really care for this story?
Pip has already gained some of the snobbery associated with the upper class he is to be a part of. What things struck you as somewhat snobbish behavior on his part? What do you think of his behavior in this chapter?
What do you think of Trabb's boy? And what of the treatment he receives from Trabb? And what of the behavior Trabb's boy has towards Pip? Much has been made about this character by scholars, so I would like to see what your thoughts are...
Pip seems to have a different opinion of Pumblechook that was perceptible in this chapter. What accounts for this changed point of view?
Why is it significant that Pip should always and forever keep the name of Pip?
I like the throwing of the horse shoes by Joe and Biddy -- a wish of good luck and safe travels. That was a nice touch.
...and so, after a lackluster farewell and brief melancholy, we come to the end of the first part of Pip's great expectations...
16 comments:
It is not surprising that Pip has already become rather snobbish towards Joe, Mrs. Joe, Biddy, and many of the other townspeople. He believes that he is better than everyone else because he has recieve a good fortune and moved up in social class leaving the people he has considered his family behind. The snobbery makes the reader feel sorry for Biddy and Joe for having to deal with such a suddenly ungrateful young man. Pip's snobbery is shown when he tells tailor about his move in social standings and lets the tailor praise him for such a good fortune. Also, when he tells Mr. Pumblechook and allows him to buy Pip dinner and continuously asks to shake Pip's hand. Although Pip has suddenly become too good for his town, he still feels bad to leave Joe and Biddy. He never tells them this out loud, but he internally does not want to leave the people that he loves. He even contemplates getting off at every stop during his trip to London and walking back home.
Pip really has become snobby, and it kind of annoys me. He is treating Joe and Biddy as if they are beneath him, when they have done so much for him and he hasn't done as much for them. It's when he adds in little snobbish adjectives when describing conversations that annoys me. For example, he even described himself talking to Biddy in a "virtuous and superior tone" at one point, when he was being anything but virtuous and superior. Pip really seems to be growing a big head, so much so, that he has even forgotten his murderous hate for Uncle Pumblechook. I do not find it surprising that Uncle Pumblechook is acting so nice towards Pip, as he seems to be a very shallow character. Pip, with his growing sense of divineness, takes right to the new Uncle Pumblechook, and is unable to see through his shallowness. I hope Pip comes over this new attitude, because I do not like it.
As earlier defined a Pip is something that is small and insignificant and as Lauren Halter said, "to break out of a shell." This suggests growth throughout the novel. It is therefore striking that Pip's benefactor would want him to keep the name of Pip. It seems so childish for a young man to continue to go by his childhood nickname. However, this seems very significant to the novel as a whole. By requiring that Pip does not go by his Christian name, Philip, Pip's benefactor suggests that he or she does not want Pip to change. Perhaps when Pip's benefactor met Pip, if he or she has ever met him, he/she was impressed by the attitude Pip had and does not want that attitude to change. Pip's benefactor believes that if Pip keeps his childhood nickname, he will also keep his childhood attributes. This is most likely not the case as we see that Pip has already become rather snobbish towards his family after recieving the news of his inheritance of a fortune. It does not look good for the person that does not want Pip to change!
In size, Pip’s ego is on the verge of surpassing his expectations. Although Pip’s change in character seemed almost abrupt in this chapter, he has been growing more and more snobbish ever since his first visit to Miss Havisham; now he’s just down-right pretentious. Pip sees his newfound fortune as a pedestal for him to stand upon and look down onto others; he is a true measure of what it is to be genteel, and he is an example of what everyone below him must yearn for. Keeping with the shallowness of character that has been building in the past few chapters, Pip only wants to teach Joe in order to make a future change in lifestyle for him fitting and worthy. Pip does not seem to understand, even after Biddy tells him so, that Joe is comfortable with were he is in life, and that he does not want his life to be “upgraded.” All that Pip wants is praise and admiration, so when he is criticized instead of lauded for his charity, he accuses Biddy of being envious and sees it fit to patronize her. There is an irony in Pip’s idea of “the bad side of human nature.” Although he is cutting Biddy up about her “envy,” it is Pip’s pride (unfortunately not the same sort as Joe’s) that falls under the very category he refers to. Pip’s change in character also brings about a change in his opinion of Pumblechook. Pip finds the glorification that he was looking for (that he did not receive from everyone else) in Pumblechook, which raises his opinion of him. Unfortunately for Pip, he doesn’t realize that he has alienated himself from the people who truly care and aligned himself with shallow suck-ups. As for Trabb’s boy, I see him as a symbol to Pip; he is brushing over Pip and trying to “make some other sign of familiarity,” which occurs to me as symbolic of Pip’s true standing in life—he is just like Trapp’s boy, insignificant, not a true gentlemen. If not for his new fortune, Pip would be treated just as Trapp’s boy is. Pip’s keeping his name is an extension of this same sort of idea—he needs to keep a hold and connection to his past and his true self. The mention of the sermon made me laugh. Although I’m not very familiar with specifics of the Bible, I am aware of the recognition placed on the poor for their struggles and humility, and, in turn, how the rich are often frowned upon for their greed and arrogance. The rich do not often make it into the kingdom of Heaven. Of course, with Pip’s new standing in life, this idea would not sit well with him.
I agree with Lauren with the part of Pip calling Biddy "envious" and "grudging". That to me was when Pip really started getting a big head about his fortune. I thought it was pretty ironic when he kept on repeating "it's a bad side of human nature". Pip was living this quote not a few weeks prior. He was so envious of wealthy people and he wanted so bad to be a gentlemen that he was practically green from it! So, shame on you, Pip for being such a hypocrite. With the whole Pumblechook situation I think that Pip wasn't completely blind to his Uncle's shallowness. In fact, I believe he was well aware of it, Pip just liked the new attention too much to care. I can't really blame him, Pip's new to the rich and famous scene. I think he has to get burned before he learns.
I feel as though Pip is growing more shallow as each chapter passes. He's starting to lose his identity since his dreams are that much closer to being achieved. The dream of being a gentleman of high class, and being free from the chains of the lower, unsophisticated people that brought him up. He always in the back of his mind realized he was better than the rest, and seeing as how he can see that to fruition, he basks upon the opportunity of being a gentleman.
I wanted to slap Pip after reading this chapter. I hated the way he started to act towards everyone. The way he changed towards Joe bugged me. I didn't like the way he started to treat Joe, Biddy, and Mrs. Joe. They raised him, and were there for him through his whole childhood! So for him to treat them that way made my heart break for poor Joe and Biddy. I think the treatment Trabb receives is very similar to how Pip was treated by Mrs. Joe. They've both received verbal abuse and bullying. Pumblechook's behavior annoyed me in this chapter as well. He always seemed to be saying that Pip was not a fit boy, yet now that he's becoming a gentleman he is so eager to take credit towards it. Also, him constantly asking to shake Pip's hand bugged me. I just didn't like his new behavior change. I think the reason for Pip to keep his name may be for him to kind of keep a part of his old self. Maybe this way he won't change completely, and he can remember where he came from and what that name stands for.
It was kind of expected, in my eyes, that Pip become a little snobby, or embracive of the new social status he was provided. While talking to Biddy earlier, it was apparent that Pip really yearned towards being a “gentleman” and to be sufficient enough to get a girl, such as Estella, in such a high social class. It seems like I’m the only one that does not find him so snobby. He is not being more shallow, for he was always shallow, but it was never expressed for he never had much to flaunt. His attraction to Estella was due to two things. First is her supposed overwhelming physical beauty. Second are her proud mannerisms and ways. Is that not shallow, superficial, and snob-loving (it should be a word haha)? The only quite snobby thing that I noticed was Pip telling Biddy to try and train Joe, so that he could come and live with him in the high class areas once Pip is settled in. It was not that Pip wanted Joe to fit in, but that Pip did not want to feel embarrassed of such an uneducated fellow being his father figure. On the other hand, he did not want to go into town with his new clothes so that he does not stand out. If his intentions were truly and sincerely snobby, would he not have walked through the town proudly, letting people kiss his hands and praise him? If you recall, as he was with Pumblechook, he tried avoiding the shaking of the hands, and Pip also mentioned that he did not know who “sir” was, for he was surely not a sir, but there was no third party in the room (another unsnobby like event). Honestly, I do not think his new treatments towards Joe are evidence of snobbiness, but rather panic. I must admit, his actions towards Biddy and Joe appeared to be seemingly superior and snobby, but as he explained his feelings to the reader (a perk of first person narration), I personally felt it apparent that Pip didn’t feel embarrassed by his family, but rather unable to communicate with them, for his change of status came so quickly and suddenly that he didn’t know which actions were appropriate. As he sat up in his room, he wanted to relate to them; he wanted to talk to them and enjoy his time with them. Trabb’s boy was an interested touch, I think. He was willing to get himself in trouble to prove a point and make a statement. He represents those lower class people in society that do not yearn for money and possessions as much as they yearn for dignity and respect. Trabb’s boy realizes that Pip did not work for anything he has gotten, and that he worked just as hard, if not harder that Pip. I love the line that goes something like “making it obvious that he was just as good as a blacksmith could ever be.” It shows that in Trabb’s boy’s eyes, Pip is still a blacksmith and always will be; just because he ran into some fortune, does not change who he is and where he came from. Once a blacksmith, always a blacksmith, I guess. I think Pumblechook was quite annoying with the handshakes and such. Talk about money and possessions defining one’s worth. I found it entertaineing that Pumblechook found it important to know Pip’s opinion in what seemed to be economoics or the market or something, just because of Pip’s new status. When I do not believe he would’ve been half as eager to know his opinion just two hours before.
It didn't surprise me that Pip wasn't very fond of the story about the rich man and the kingdom of Heaven. This story says that it is very very hard for a rich man to get into the kingdom of Heaven because most (not all) people who are very rich, love their money more than anything else, especially God. Pip was a little uncomfortable with this being said just after he came into so much money, because nobody likes the thought that they are not going to Heaven. Pip has already shown that he sees himself as higher in the social totem pole because of this money. The reader can see it in the way that he thinks of Joe and the way he treats his family. Also, while he was in town he kept explaining his situation over and over again when it really was not needed. He could have just said what he needed and explained if he was asked. However, he took the opportunity to brag about his situation just like a person would if they had been rich all their life.
As other people pointed out, Pip has taken on a rather conceited demeanor towards Joe, Biddy, and those in his home town. Although he has money and is well off he is still lacking the maturity it seems to compose himself in a polite manner. The addition of Trabb's boy was a important to the novel. He seemed to be the contrast of Pip. Where Pip started common and yearned to become uncommon and rise in society, Trabb's boy is meant to be the lower class who is content where they are in society. Trabb's boy seems to be disgusted with Pip's attitude, after he abandons the standards he grew up with for the higher end of life. Trabb's boy seems to be willing to prove himself to Pip by causing a disturbance in his father's shop not caring about the consequences. I think Pip keeping his name forever is a bit of foreshadowing in the novel. Maybe his benefactor will want to ensure a way of getting in touch with him once time has passed?
I do agree Pip's snobbishness is rather annoying especially to Joe, his dear friend who he suffered along side and to Biddy, who never bragged about anything. It doesnt seem like it would be in Pip's character to become more judgmental. maybe he was confused and started acting like Estella. The church service was very interesting and an ironic part of the story. i think Pip was already uneasy about what was about to happen and the service kinda of told him he needed to be in a different place and mind set than he had already been in for self improvement. I think the Trabs boy shows contentment with his position in society andd life while Pip seems to have goals and inspiration for improvement. As for Pumblechook, Pip feels like he has finally overcome the barrier of not rising above this man and his fear of him. Now he feels he has a superiority and doesnt have to answer to him or take his critcisms as before. Pip should keep his name because the person that gave himm his fortune values the boy for who he is and his personality he has learned from that life and wants him to remain tied to it. Maybe also so Pip can see the social fall and rise or rise and fall.
I think throughout the last couple chapters Pip has started to undergo changes in his personality. I believe that due to his exposure to Miss Havisham and Estella and their oh-so snobby ways, he has slowly been influenced by them. After realizing the town has slowly started to think more and more highly of him, he started to look down his nose on some of the less fortunate. This becomes clearly evident when he is very reluctant to have Joe and Biddy accompany him to his departure to London. This implies that in Pip's mentality he has thought of Joe and Biddy of lessers. The snobby thoughts in his mind once dormant have finally started to manifest themselves in reality.
It’s getting harder and harder to find interesting things in this book. I can’t believe the plot, it’s so stale. Maybe this book was enticing when it came out in the 19th century, but right now, there are children’s cartoons with better stories. There’s an episode of Clifford the Big Red Dog I remember where the girl dog (Pip) falls in love with a rich blue dog (Pip’s dreams and Estella), and spends a lot of time with him. Clifford (Joe) and T-Bone (Biddy) are sad, and become upset because their old friend now looks down on their poor status and doesn’t appreciate all they’ve done for her. If I had to compare this story to anything, it would be that episode of Clifford the Big Red Dog. At least Clifford makes the idea a little more interesting, since the characters are all dogs, but in Great Expectations the only things that mix up the story are Mrs. Joe’s attack and the constant stream of escaped criminals. It’s not like the main idea behind the story is so bad, it’s just that the book plays it out so generically. There’s nothing about the characters or their actions that makes them special. This book needs excitement.
It seems sort of sad that Pip yearns so bad to be something that he is not, only to impress a girl. He was surrounded by many who loved him, but perhaps he felt the suffocation of a small town and wished to move on to a greater purpose (which, in his dreams, is marrying Estella). It's good that he is instructed to keep the name Pip, even through his "change," because this name still connects him to his meek beginnings. The name "Phillip" would have detached him from the days he was called "Pip," and maybe add to Pip's haughtiness and repudiation of life in the village.
Pip is beginning to feel guilty about being rich. He did not like having his last time with Joe reminding him of leaving. Pip also didn't like to be reminded of how rich God is, while being as nice. He looked up to Estella as an example of the rich and she was very mean.
Pip is beginning to look down on the common people even more. His thought reflect the idea that he is better then they are, even though he hasn't become a gentleman yet. Pip is also meaner to Biddy, he is cutting- and telling her off more often. Pip also feels he must arrange for Joe's educattion, as if he is responsible for the family's lives now that he is rich, and that he would change them, even if the family likes how they live.
I think that Pip is told to always keep the name Pip because his benefactor saw something in him and does not want him to change. Pip has only just gotten some money and already it has started to change him. It also just makes Pip’s ego bigger when Pumblechook keeps asking to shake Pip’s hand and calling Pip sir. It really makes me angry that already Pip has started to forget who has been nice to him (Joe and Biddy) and who treated him cruelly (everyone else).
Post a Comment