Tuesday, August 08, 2017

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 7

Why start the story of the tiger immediately following the story of the deathless man? Is there a connection?

Notice the foreshadowing in the first section of Chapter 7 (pg. 191 in my version).

What is a gusla? What is significant about this item that makes it a great symbol for the story?

We seem to get a lot of extraneous information in this story, especially about Luka. Assuming that it is not extraneous -- that the author does, indeed, have a purpose for this information -- what would that purpose be? Why do we need to know that Luka is a homosexual? Why do we need to know about his goals and aspirations? Find a piece of information that you thought was pointless and try to figure out why that information might actually have purpose and meaning.

Why does Vera allow the narrator's grandfather to carry on a relationship with the tiger's wife?

Do you think Luka was killed by his wife? By the tiger? Or do you think he finally just left?

Why do you think the tiger's wife gave him the hair?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 8

What do you think is in the blue bag?

Why does Dure stuff his relive's body into the valise? How would one even manage this?

Why does the narrator volunteer to go to the crossroads for Dure and his family? Is it only to get the kids to the clinic, or is there another reason?\

Although filled with superstitions, this burial is not much more odd than the burial traditions of many religions and cultures. What burial traditions do you find odd in today's society...or even in your own religion?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 9

How closely are taxidermy and the profession of the butcher associated? Is there a tie between Darisa and Luka? If taxidermy is "restoring the dead," what is the job of a butcher?

Interesting...we have Darisa hunting for Death, and the deathless man, who is related to Death...

What is the relationship between hunting and death? By default, then, what is Darisa's relationship with death once he becomes a great hunter?

Why wasn't Darisa with his cart and oxen? Was this a trap set by him to catch the tiger? Or the tiger's wife? And what hit the tiger when it attacked the oxen? Darisa was nowhere in sight...

Why did Darisa try to kill the tiger's wife and the narrator's grandfather? What reasoning would he have?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 10

What explanation can you come up with for Arlo's death based on the information provided? What causes the awkwardness in the conversation between the narrator and Fra Anton as he tells the story of his brother's death?

Why do you think Fra Anton is so protective of the narrator? What is he protecting her from (or, rather, what does he think he is protecting her from)?

Who takes the jar? Why do you think she follows the man?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 11

What would it be like to watch the bombing of Bedford on TV as we sat in our Bedford homes? Would we be like the characters in the book and stick it out? Go to coffee houses? I hope it never happens, but I wonder how we'd all react. Would we make signs of protest? Would we unite to save on of the stables full of horses in the area?

Disturbing images from Zora and the narrator's experiences in the hospital. How is it possible to deal with that level of destruction to the human body?

When telling of how crippled animals are treated in the United States, the narrator says, "They're self-righting." What does she mean by this statement?

On p. 283, the narrator pontificates about the differing natures of war. What might this reflect about the author's views of war?

Review the three sections where the narrator's grandfather starts his stories about the deathless man. Do the descriptions of the grandfather's actions as he begins each part of the story reveal anything?

On the bottom of p. 284, the grandfather tells about the religious differences between he and his wife. What point is he making here?

It just occurred to me to ask this, though I have wondered it throughout the story: why does the deathless man always ask for water?

What is narghile? tumbak?

Was the woman whom the deathless man was with the same woman who abandoned Luka on his wedding day?

Why do you think the deathless man's favorite story from The Jungle Book is Rikki Tikki Tavi's story?

The deathless man says the grandfather will die with suddenness, but we know that he suffers for quite some time before his death. How does this make sense?

Is there any significance in the death of the zoo tiger?

What is the deathless man suggesting when he tells the narrator's grandfather to break the cup?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 12

What is it about the apothecary's story that explains who he became as a person? What attributes would you imagine him having based on his experiences before he became an apothecary?

The apothecary learned that "people would turn first to superstition to find meaning, to stitch together unconnected events in order to understand what was happening." What do people in the United States today look to when they seek understanding?

Why does the apothecary kill the tiger's wife? How did this shape the narrator's grandfather?

What makes the apothecary so intensely still and "steady and resigned" as he waited for his execution? What had pulled the fight out of him?

Why does Marko say, "What has that got to do with anything?" Why isn't the burial spot of the tiger's wife important to him?

The Tiger's Wife: Chapter 13

So who is it that the narrator has followed? The deathless man? The mora? Someone else? What evidence leads you to your conclusion?

Is there irony in the fact that the narrator has promised not to tell the wife, yet she is telling us the whole story?

What are your thoughts on the ending of this novel? Is it a satisfactory ending? Why/why not?

Now that you have finished the novel, look at the last page where there are questions for a book club. Some of them are very good. You may want to address one or more of these here. If your version doesn't have the questions, find someone who does have the questions.

Wednesday, July 26, 2017

Tiger's Wife Chapter 1

In the epilogue, why isn't the narrator more affected by the tiger attack? It must have been traumatic to watch...After the attack, how is she able to still love the tigers instead of fearing them?

40 days of the soul...what religion are we talking about here? What war is being referenced?

Why is this family so secretive that they will resort to lies about health issues? Is your family like this at all?

Her grandmother clearly knows that the narrator is lying to her. Why doesn't she press harder once she knows this?

What's with all the drawings and portraits of the dog?

What does the fact that the parrot spouts poetry tell us as readers?

Why do Barba and Nada allow the diggers to stay at their house? What does this tell us about them?

Why doesn't Natalia tell Zora about her grandfather's death yet? They are supposed to be BFFs.

Tiger's Wife Chapter 2

What happened at Sarobar? What is rakija?

Have you ever had a ritual or standing date with a parent or grandparent that you grew out of over the years? Did you make it clear that you had outgrown it? How was that message received?

A view of wartime that we rarely get...those not close to the fighting were leading a relatively normal life. Does this seem surprising?

What would you do if there was a war going on in our country...say, in Minnesota (assuming the Canadians have attacked)? Would you go to school? Would you sell contraband on the black market? Would you try to acquire things from the black market? Where would you fall in this spectrum?

Why does grandfather act so defiantly, knowing that he may be risking his family's well being?

What is the strangest, most interesting thing you've seen at night? Share with us...if we're worthy...

Do you have any stories that have been passed down to you? Give a brief summary and then explain why the story is important to you.

What are your thoughts on the story of the deathless man?

Tiger's Wife Chapter 3

Why is Dure so adamant about not taking his kids to a doctor?

Do you see any parallels or links between this chapter and the the story of the deathless man?

Does your family or anyone you know still believe in and/or practice home remedies for illnesses? What are they? Do they work?

Tiger's Wife Chapter 4

How is anthromorphism put to work in the story of the tiger? What purpose does it serve for the author?

How does this tiger's story parallel that of Pi's story? How are the two tigers different at this point?

Great quote: "...if you are making your journey in a hurry, you are making it poorly."

Why is everyone in Galina so bothered by outsiders?

What would make someone want to entice a tiger with meat and continually bring it closer to them? If you were enticing a tiger, would you want to lure it further away from you?

What is a bey?

There are two stories about the tiger hunt -- the real story and the one manufactured by the survivors. Why do you think they made up the story they told to the town?

Tiger's Wife Chapter 5

Why would her grandfather have gone in search of the deathless man so late in his life?

How did the barman figure out that she was related to the man who had died (her grandfather)?

What is significant about the death of the boys?

Why is the narrator still being so secretive about her whereabouts when it comes to Zora, her bff?

This book relies very heavily on description. Do you feel the description serves a purpose most of the time, or do you think it's just window dressing? Give an example and explain your thoughts.

Tiger's Wife Chapter 6

It seems that a lot of older people get together to discuss and reminisce about things, sometimes at the VFW, sometimes the bingo hall, or sometimes at bridge parties. Do your grandparents do this? Your parents? What is their standing date with their friends? What purpose does this type of get together serve in the bigger scheme of things? What do these gatherings tell us about ourselves as humans?

Who do you think is the "stupid son of a bitch" that her grandfather is referring to while tending to the Marshall? What was the real cause of his illness?

Her grandfather makes two rather cryptic statements: "You'll be leaving God out of it, then," followed closely by, "With children, you're on your own." Explain what he means here.

How does one develop "nonchalance in the face of death"? Why do doctors need this attitude? Is it a healthy attitude for doctors to have? Does it make them better doctors?

What do you make of the story of the lake-house fire? Why is this such an important memory for the narrator? Why does her grandfather choose the day after the fire to continue the story of the deathless man? is there a connection?

What is your take on visions of iconic religious figures in everyday items (Jesus in a French fry, Mary in a bagel, etc.)? Do you believe these claims when you hear them? Have you seen one in person? How do you react to these sorts of claims?

Why does the deathless man feel that his situation is punishment? What makes it feel like punishment?

Thursday, July 06, 2017

Chapter 7: Heavier Boots

What do you think compelled all of the Blacks to show up for Oskar's play?
Why does Oskar fantasize such a violent ending to Hamlet?
I wonder if The Cyclone is still standing after Hurricane Sandy...just wondering...
Oskar ends his Saturday with Ada Black by saying it was depressing. What do you think was so depressing about it?
Oskar has a growing list of cultural history created from old Mr. Black's stories. Anything stick out to you on that list? Any connections between the things on the list? Just wondering what you see or notice...
What is significant about the dates on the rocks?
If you were on one of old Mr. Black's cards, what one word would be next to your name? Tell me why it would be that word.
Why do you think old Mr. Black had turned off his hearing aids? Why do you think he was crying?
Why do you think we get the memory of message Message Three right after his visit with old Mr. Black?
How do you feel about Oskar's interaction with his mom at the end of the chapter? Why do you feel this way?
Oskar goes through a variety of moods in a very short period of time. Do you think these are actual moods, or is he just being dramatic?

Why is this chapter given the title "Heavier Boots"?

Chapter 8: My Feelings

Oskar's grandmother states, "He never took pictures of me, and we didn't buy life insurance." What does this statement tell us about the character and their relationship?
When did his grandma move? Where did she move to?
Why is it so important that Oskar's grandfather's hands didn't lose their roughness? What caused them to remain coarse?
Her mother's pearls are mentioned a few times. Is this significant? If so, why? Explain.
Why was she thinking of shoes?
"He promised us that everything would be ok. I was a child, but I knew that everything would not be ok. That did not make my father a liar. It made him my father." What is the significance of this quote? What does it tell us?
While helping her to learn about makeup, her mother cries. Why?

Why does Oskar's grandmother get rid of all the pers from the apartment?

Chapter 9: Happiness, Happiness

A very graphic, first-hand description of the atomic bomb attack on Japan. What is significant about Oskar's choice to share this with the class? How is it connected?
How does the story of Buckminster fit in on a deeper level?
Why do you think Stan pulls his hand back from Mr. Black when they are introduced?
There are some good sections that highlight the generation gap between Mr. Black and Oskar.  Which ones did you notice, and how do they help build the characters or the story?
Why does Oskar insist on finding out if Agnes Black had any kids? Is Mr. Black lying about the answer? If he is, why would he do that?
What do the letters from Gary Franklin and Jane Goodall tell us about Oskar? What does this second response from Stephen Hawking tell us?
Oskar states that he sometimes thinks that the key opens everything. What has it opened so far?
What do you learn about Oskar from his session with the therapist? What do you learn about his mother from the choppy conversation that Oskar eavesdrops on?
Why does he listen to his father's message when he gets home from his therapy session?

The chapter is titled "Happiness, Happiness." Why?

Chapter 10: Why I'm Not Where You Are 4/12/78

Why has this chapter been marked up in red? What does that tell you?
So Oskar's grandfather had gotten Anna pregnant before the bombing of Dresden. How does this change your view of him and his behavior when he gets the news that Oskar's grandmother was going to have his baby?
While he's in the hospital after the bombing of Dresden, Oskar's grandfather says he was operated on, but it was the nurse's touch that saved his life. Why do you think he says this?
He says that "thousands of people were left to suffer hope." What does he mean by this?
How does this letter to Oskar's father change your view of his grandfather, if at all?

Simon Goldberg writes his grandfather a brief letter. Goldberg is an actual figure in history...you may want to find out a little about him...and think about how this letter may have affected Oskar's penchant for writing letters to famous people.

Chapter 11: The Sixth Borough

Why does Oskar's father tell him the story of the Sixth Borough? What is the moral of the story here? How does it tie in with Oskar's earlier search in Central Park?

Chapter 12: My Feelings

Why is the interview with the father of the missing girl so important to this story?
There's a shift in the conversation...she starts off the story by referring to Oskar as "you"...then she shifts and says "I wanted to turn to face him, but I couldn't. I moved my hand to touch his hand." Assuming that this is not an oversight, why would she switch how she's telling the story (from telling him the story to telling us the story)?
Why is the sound that Oskar makes at the cemetery so important to his grandmother?

Why is Oskar's grandfather apologizing...or what is he apologizing for?

Chapter 13: Alive and Alone

I think it's the first time I've seen the phrase "extremely loud" in the book. In this case, it's pessimistic thinking that is so loud in his mind...not sure where that will lead...
Why are all of the envelopes empty?
Great description: "He was on one kind of carpet, I was on another. The line where they came together reminded me of a place that wasn't in any borough." Why is this such good description?
Why is Oskar's grandfather so reticent to tell Oskar who he is?
What do you find interesting about Oskar's visit with Georgia Black?
Why does he think of another letter from Stephen Hawking at this point? How is this significant?
Why does Oskar give himself a bruise at the coffee shop?
For the first time I see the phrase "incredibly close."
Why do you think Oskar has done so much research on 9/11?
It interests me and saddens me how much life has changed since 9/11...Oskar's fears at the Empire State Building would not have been fears before that attack...
I never knew a plane had crashed into the Empire State Building...or that it was built with moorings for zeppelins...
What is the heart of the story about the Empire State Building guide, Ruth? Why is it an important story?
How is it that Oskar doesn't know this is his grandfather, even though he gives the reader so many clues?

End of chapter -- "loud and close" again...

Chapter 14: Why I'm Not Where You Are 9/11/03

What did you make of the way this chapter was started?
What is different about this door knob?
Why does Oskar's grandmother allow Thomas back into her life?
The code using telephone pad numbers may have thrown you. Here is a comment I found on the internet concerning this code:

“On behalf of my English classes, I wrote to Mr. Foer’s agent several years ago, asking about the number code in ELIC. He was kind enough to respond personally; regretting the time my students had spent decoding, and admitting that the numbers can’t be deciphered. He did say that in a way, this is consistent with the theme of people trying to communicate and failing, but the numbers themselves are more or less random, with a few exceptions. I hope this helps.”

If you do a search for this decoding, you will find that many have tried and have only been able to decode bits and pieces. I think the explanation above will suffice, so don't kill yourself trying to decode it. If, however, you do find a way to decode it, by all means share what you decoded.
What do you find interesting/confusing/disturbing about Oskar's grandmother's behavior towards "the renter"?

Chapter 15: A Simple Solution to an Impossible Problem

Notice the parallel between Oskar's thoughts on not knowing when the "last time" would be and the thoughts on this in the previous chapter. What is significant about this?
Where does Oskar think Mr. Black is? Why is this significant? Where do you think Mr. Black is?
Why doesn't Oskar's mother care about Oskar going all over New York city at night? If his mother knew what he was doing all this time, what is her motivation for not talking about it with Oskar? What is significant about her involvement in contacting everyone before Oskar even arrived?
The phrase "incredibly close" shows up twice in this chapter...the phrase "extremely loud" shows up once...
Why is the picture of the back of a man's head included in the chapter?
William Black's father wrote letters before he died -- a lot of them. Letters show up a lot in this novel -- some sent, some not sent. Why do you think the author uses letters so much in the novel? What do they represent?
Why do you think Oskar didn't want to go to the bank with William? Why do you think he told William the story about the last message? Why is it so critical that he finally told someone?

What is significant and powerful about Stephen Hawking's letter and the timing with which Oskar receives it?

It makes sense that Thomas (Oskar's father) wanted to meet his own father...but why did he see him only once after he had found him? And why is Thomas' father still writing letters to him?
If it was Simon Goldberg in the bookstore, why would he simply hug Oskar's grandfather and then run away?
Why do you think Mr. Black never told Oskar about his grandfather?

What do you think about those last few pages that get more and more dense with typing?

Chapter 16: My Feelings

Oskar's grandma says something interesting when he offers to get her magazines like he used to do: "I told him to bring a suitcase so he could come back with one of everything." She follows this up by stating: "I wanted him to be able to take his things with him." What does this reveal?
What parallels do you see between the reactions she has when the grandfather is thinking of leaving and those she has when she is leaving her father to die?
What is the significance of her dream that is interspersed here?
Why didn't she say anything to him before about him seeing Oskar?
Why does he bury the letters?

What message is this chapter (which is a letter to Oskar) trying to get through to Oskar?

Chapter 17: Beautiful and True

What is so important about the interaction between Ron and Oskar?
Why is Oskar so interested in Gerald's daughters and his relationship with them?
What does Oskar mean when he refers to digging up his dad's coffins as "a simple solution to an impossible problem"?
Why isn't his mom angry or curious about his late night trip to the cemetery?
His mother tells him that his dad had called her. What does this do for Oskar? Why doesn't he share with her about the messages he hid from her?
What does Oskar's reversal of the pictures and the imagined reversal of time remind you of?

The chapter was entitled "Beautiful and True". What is beautiful and true about this chapter?

Some Additional Questions About the Book as a Whole

Do you find Oskar sympathetic or annoying? Or both?
Oskar "plays Yorick" (the long dead jester whose skull Hamlet holds in his hand!) in a school production. What is the significance of that role?
Jonathan Safran Foer has said that he writes about characters and their miscommunications: some characters think they're saying a lot but say nothing; others say nothing but end up saying a lot. Which characters fall into which category in Extremely Loud? What might Foer be saying about our ability to communicate deep-seated emotions?
Do you see this book as a work of realism (in which case the mother's role would matter) ... or as more of a fable? If the latter, what is Extremely Loud a fable of?
Do you find the illustrations, scribblings, over-written texts, etc. a meaningful, integral part of the work? Or do you find them distracting and gimmicky? Why are they there?
How do both main plot and subplot (Oskar's grandfather and the bombing of Dresden) interweave with one another?
(Source: http://www.litlovers.com)

What do you think is the significance of the novel's title?
Who was your favorite character? Why?  
Were there any passages or scenes that you remember well or particularly liked?
Any comments about the way the book ended?
(Source:  http://www.galesburglibrary.org)

Which Beatles reference makes the greatest impact in the novel? How would you explain their centrality in the Schell household?
How does Mr. A. R. Black's deafness contribute to the storyline?
Which of Oskar Schell's inventions would you most like to see implemented and how would it work?
Which of Oskar Schell's phobias seems the most debilitating and how?
What do Dresden, Hiroshima, and 9/11 share in common? How do they differ?


Monday, June 19, 2017

Chapter 1: What the?

Remember: You don't have to answer all the questions...one or two will do fine...or even just your own commentary. Just make sure you have a decent paragraph so I can count it for credit. This should be a conversational blog, so don't try to sound smarter than you are...nobody likes that guy...just be you and seek out new info when you can.

Raison d'ĂȘtre = reason for existence
Ce n'etais pas moi = It's not/wasn't me

Why does the narrator want to create/invent all of the things he speaks of at the beginning of the chapter? What does that reveal about him?
What does it tell us about the narrator that his physical activity before jujitsu was tambourining?
What does the narrator mean when he says, "Jose"? What does this do to characterize him?
"even though I don't have dreams of running the family jewelry business anymore..." What is the double entendre of this quote?
Why does he only wear white clothes? Does this suggest something about him?
Interesting...before 9/11, no one would have ever thought about a plane hitting a building below the 95th floor...and would have rarely thought of a plane hitting a building at all...

"Even  though I'm not anymore, I used to be an atheist, which means I didn't believe in things that couldn't be observed. I believed that once you're dead, you're dead forever, and you don't feel anything, and you don't even dream. It's not that I believe in things that can't be observed now, because I don't. It's that I believe that things are extremely complicated." What does the narrator mean by this? What does this tell us about the narrator?
What is his mom holding and squeezing? What does this tell us about her?
Why does his grandmother bring up the fact that his grandfather loved animals more than he loved people? What does this tell us about their relationship?
"Zipping up the sleeping bag of myself" -- what does this phrase mean? What does it reveal about him?
Why does the narrator think his mom would rather have the narrator be dead than his father? How do you think this affects their relationship?
The second time he rode in a limo, he went with the renter to dig up his dad's coffin. Foreshadowing...

Besides the marking of the New York Times with a red pen (which is only anal if you're not an English teacher, by the way), how is his father characterized?
The narrator uses the phrase "made my boots lighter" a couple of times. What does this mean? What does it reveal about him?
What do you think the narrator's father said in the four messages that we didn't get to look at? What did his father say in that final phone conversation? What would you say?

Chapter 2: Why I’m Not Where You Are 5/21/63

What caused his grandfather to lose his words? How do you think this affects him and those around him?
"She was the tree and also the river flowing away from the tree." What do you make of this quote? What does this tell you?
Near the end of the chapter, the last half paragraph, his grandfather's thoughts become jumbled, almost manic in nature. These thoughts are followed by him pointing to the word HELP. What does this tell us about the relationship between the grandfather and grandmother? 


What is the significance of the picture in this chapter? How do you think it fits in?

Chapter 3: Googolplex

Oskar says that Sonny, the homeless person he knows, "puts me in heavy boots." What does this mean? How does he deal with this?
Why does Oskar put his father's messages into morse code jewelry? What does this tell us about Oskar? What does this tell us about the messages?
Interesting analogy about the beavers -- why do you think Oskar feels so far away from everything?
What is so alluring for a child about a parent's closet?
Why does Oskar give himself a bruise even though he shouldn't have? What does that mean?
Why is Oskar being so sneaky while trying to find out what the key is for? Why not ask his mother?
Why is he so indifferent about getting a letter and T-shirt from Ringo Starr? He says he's excited and he laminates the letter, but doesn't seem very excited...only mentioned briefly...And why did he receive them in the first place?
Why does Oskar put all of the images from his internet search in a file named "Stuff That Happened to Me", even though these things didn't actually happen to him? What is significant about the pictures in the chapter?
Why is Oskar's father's name written on the pads in the art store if the pads weren't there before he died? How is that possible?
Oskar seems to go to a lot of trouble to make sure his mom doesn't have the messages. Why not just erase them?
So is "the renter" a real person or just an imaginary friend of Oskar's grandmother?
The phone was a secret "that was a hole in the middle of me that every happy thing fell into." Why does he hold onto the phone so tightly and secretively, then?
Interesting list of people he loved...especially the order...what does this tell the reader about Oskar?
What is he conjugating at the end of the chapter? Why?

Chapter 4: My Feelings

What is so important about the letters that Oskar's grandmother is collecting? What is important about letters in general? As opposed to, say, emails or texts?
How could her grandmother love rivers and lakes if she had never learned to swim? Most non-swimmers would at least harbor fear -- if not hate -- of bodies of water...
What message was her grandmother trying to convey with the story of the ruby bracelet?


I found the sculpting story through the proposal to be very beautiful but tragic...I couldn't help but think of Jack and Rose in Titanic...What are your thoughts on this section? Why do you view this scene in this way?

Chapter 5: The Only Animal

I like Oskar's father's philosophy of existence...very simple, very true...or is it?
On his quest to find the Black on the envelope, Oskar lists the things he packs. What things stand out to you? Why do they stand out?
Oskar writes letters to famous scientists quite frequently, it seems. Have you ever written to someone famous? Did you get a reply?
What do you think Oskar's grandmother has nightmares about? How do you know this?
Why is Mr. Black crying?
Besides what is documented here in this chapter, what else do you think could be on the list of things only humans do?

Chapter 6: Why I’m Not Where You Are 5/21/63

"I change the sheets every morning to wash away my writing." What does this mean?
Looking at each of the rules that Thomas and his wife have, I have to wonder how each of the rules came into existence. Take a look at each rule. What do you think happened that made that rule a rule?

What is the history of Dresden? Look that up and see how that might have affected the grandparents.
On his last night with his wife, when he covers her eyes and says "Something", followed by "We must be", what is Thomas trying to communicate?
Here's a good question: It's 1963. He is writing a letter to his unborn son. How does he know it will be a boy?
Why does Anna's father bury books? I mean, the book kind of tells us, but think about it more...why does Anna's father bury the books?
Did you notice the difference between the two pictures of the door knob? Why is that difference significant? What do you think it represents?
What a tragic story about the writing of her life story...what does that symbolize? There is the obvious, but I think there is more. What do you think?
Explain why Thomas is leaving-- from your perspective, not his.
What happens at the end of the chapter on those one-sentence pages? Explain to the best of your ability...what happened there?
Simon Goldberg is an actual historical figure...figure out what he's about, and you will better understand the exchange between him and Thomas.